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The "Brain Booster" Thread

Discussion in 'Cerebral Health & Anti-Aging' started by Wise Guy, Oct 24, 2008.

  1. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Fellas I've been busy with some exciting new research(for me)

    This all started a few weeks ago. A friend has been using a particular substance called a "smart drug", and the effects have been jaw dropping. Transformational. A complete 180 degree change in behavior and attitude.

    This is a subject that is rarely talked about in these boards.

    Cognitive functioning is duely important. The brain is an organ that ages, just like the testicals, in a similar manner.

    Many here restore levels of testosterone and other androgenic hormones, GH, and such, and keep estrogen at bay. Lab results look great. Yet energy is not there, attention, memory problems still exist. A general feeling of apathy is present.

    This is characterized by a general low level of depression. This seems to affect EVERYONE over the age of 25, albiet to varying degrees. The brain ages, and almost becomes "hypogonadal" in its own way.

    One becomes less talkative, less assertive. Memory isn't quite as sharp. Attention, and ability to get things done in a quick, orderly manner is compromised.

    As the brain ages, its ability to produce and maintain youthful levels of neurotransmitters declines. There are various reasons for such an insufficiency. For instance, there might be a lack of enzymes involved in the neurotransmitter synthesis.

    Nevertheless, in many cases, providing the brain with ample raw materials necessary to make neurotransmitters can restore them to more youthful levels and thus help maintain cognitive function at vigorous youthful levels. Furthermore, there are declines in immune and endocrine functioning. Certain nootropics enhance immune and endocrine functioning.

    Lipofuscin is the name given to finely granular yellow brown pigment granules composed of lipid-containing residues of lysosomal digestion. It is considered one of the aging or "wear and tear" pigments; found in the liver, kidney, heart muscle, adrenals, nerve cells, and ganglion cells. It is specifically arranged around the nucleas.

    Blood flow to the brain is also an important factor in brain health. Blood delivers the oxygen and nutrients necessary for normal functioning. Unfortunately, even during normal aging, blood flow to the brain may decrease by an average of 20 percent. The decreased blood flow that results from aging and associated diseases can cause nerve cells in the brain to be lost prematurely. This loss may contribute to the decline of cognitive function

    So what we have people is a combination of three primary problems - A build up of lipofuscin and a decline of neutrotransmitters, with decreased blood flow.

    Which leads to nootropics. Popularly referred to as "smart drugs", "smart nutrients", "cognitive enhancers" and "brain enhancers", are a class of drugs that improve impaired human cognitive abilities (the functions and capacities of the brain). The term covers a broad range of substances including drugs, nutrients and herbs that have purported cognitive enhancing effects.

    Nootropics are an exciting branch of anti aging medicine. I havent been this excited about a substance in a long, long time.

    I myself have been deep, deep in research of nootropics.

    For lack of time, I will stop the thread here and suggest that you now do a little research of your own. Perhaps contribute to this thread.

    Hear are three pages to get you started. I suggest you start with the wiki thread. Learn the drugs. Then begin with the second link. Then the third. Read every post, every page(there are 40 plus pages on this thread, make sure you see that)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nootropic
    http://www.lef.org/protocols/neurological/mild_cognitive_impairment_01.htm
    http://www.t-nation.com/free_online...nutrition_supplements/brain_function_boosters
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2008
  2. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Thanks to T-Bone at t-nation

    The Top Smart Drugs & Nutrients:

    The following are the safest and most widely appreciated substances for improving your mental function.

    Acetyl-L-Carnitine:
    Acetyl-L-Carnitine (ALC) is a naturally occurring amino acid and found in small quantities in milk. Because it is a common factor in many areas of the body it has a wide diversity of effects. These include benefits for depression, stroke, neuronal protection and the enhancement of the action of the mitochondria. Many of the theories of aging center on the reduction in efficiency of the mitochondria; ALC's ability to support their function and prevent their decline is an obvious "anti-aging" benefit. ALC also increases brain cell metabolism and has been shown to improve memory, reaction time, and other cognitive functions. Dosage: 500 - 2000 mg daily

    DHEA:
    Dehydroepiandrosterone (pronounced dee-hi-dro-ep-i-an-dro-stair-own) or abbreviated to DHEA, is a steroid hormone produced naturally by the adrenal gland, and is the most abundant steroid found in the human blood stream. Research indicates that DHEA has significant anti obesity, anti cancer, cognitive enhancement and anti aging effects. DHEA levels naturally decline as we get older, and there is strong reason to think that DHEA supplements may extend life span and make us more youthful. Dosage: Women 10 - 25 mg daily, Men 25 - 50 mg daily

    Ginkgo Biloba:
    A great deal has been said about ginkgo since we introduced it in Smart Drugs & Nutrients. This supplement improves many brain functions including memory, attention, and concentration. It is also particularly good for ringing in the ears, dizziness, and general balance especially in the elderly. Dosage: 60 - 240 mg daily

    Phosphatidylserine: (PS)
    PS is food for your brain cell membranes. Much of your brain's cell membranes are made up of PS and, with supplementation, you may see improvements in a wide variety of cognitive functions that tend to decline with age such as: memory, learning, concentration, general mood, and alertness. PS is also particularly effective at reducing the ill effects of stress and helps keep cortisol levels down (important for long term anti-aging purposes.) Dosage: start at 200 - 300 mg for one month, then taper down to 100 mg per day

    Pregnenolone:
    Pregnenolone may be one of the most effective, broad ranged and yet one of the safest anti-aging therapies at our disposal today. With its decades of safe and efficacious clinical use, the scope of treatments have included, alleviating stress, improving and extending energy levels, reducing arthritic inflammations, enhancing memory and acting as an antidepressant. The reason that pregnenolone can have such different uses is because it is the first sterone derived from cholesterol.

    In fact it is the grandmother of all the steroids and neuro-steroids, it forms their basic material (it is a precursor). Without plentiful pregnenolone availability there is likely to be an "imbalance" of other steroids. For example estrogen, testosterone, progesterone and DHEA are all "sourced" from pregnenolone. Dosage: 10 - 100 mg daily

    Vinpocetine:
    Vinpocetine is a new addition to the latest class of "smart nutrients," a class which has a specific effects on the chemical reactions that go on inside cells, to invigorate the brain and make it work normally. Vinpocetine, when taken regularly allows the brain to make better use of oxygen and energy. The brain accounts for only 2% of total body weight, however it receives between 15% to 20% of the blood, in order to enable it to receive energy from the sugar glucose. The brain only has small reserves of energy, and they can be expended within 2 to 3 minutes, if they have to be used. This means that proper brain function depends upon good blood flow, oxygen and glucose supply. Dosage: 5mg 2-3x daily

    Smart Drugs

    Deprenyl:
    Deprenyl is currently the most promising therapy in the struggle against aging. Deprenyl is sold in the United States under the trade name of Eldepryl. Recent studies have shown that Deprenyl has a variety of beneficial effects on brain aging, without producing any toxic side effects. There is much evidence to suggest that Deprenyl is an antidepressant, a sexual stimulant, an effective treatment for Parkinson's disease and a useful treatment for Alzheimer's disease, as well as an anti-aging therapy.

    Hydergine: (Ergoloid Mesylates)
    Hydergine is considered to be one of the most important "smart drugs" available today. This is because it acts in a number of different ways to enhance mental capabilities and slows or regresses the aging processes in the brain. Hydergine is the brand name of the group of drugs known as Ergoloid Mesylates, and is widely regarded, as the best form available. Dosage: 3 - 9 mg daily

    Modafinil:
    Modafinil is an eugeroic drug, (which simply means "good arousal"). This unique class contains only two at present, adrafinil and modafinil, both of which have been developed by Lafon Laboratories of France. Currently, their use and effectiveness is little known outside of Europe. The basis of their uniqueness lies in their ability to only "stimulate when stimulation is required." As a result the "highs and lows" associated with other stimulants such as amphetamine are absent with eugeroics. Their initial use often produces comments such as "I can't tell any difference." But it is only several hours later when one realizes that attention and awakeness are the same as earlier, that one is aware of their benefit. Dosage: 100 - 200 mg daily

    Piracetam:
    Piracetam is an intelligence booster, and CNS (central nervous system) stimulant with no known toxicity or addictive properties. Piracetam has been described by many people as a drug that "wakes up your brain". Piracetam's effect and safety have been so impressive, that it created a new classification of drugs called Nootropics. The term Nootropic is Greek and means "acting on the mind." Since the creation of Piracetam, many pharmaceutical companies have been very busy developing further Nootropic drugs, such as Oxiracetam. Currently there are no FDA approved Nootropic drugs in the United States. If approval is gained the market for Nootropic drugs in the US alone is expected to be in excess of $1 billion a year (22). In the meantime, Piracetam can be ordered from European and Offshore pharmacies. Dosage: 2400 - 4800 mg daily

    Centrophenoxine:
    Centrophenoxine is an anti-aging drug widely used in Europe to increase brain energy. Centrophenoxine stimulates chemical activity of the brain, in particular the uptake of the sugar glucose is increased. Glucose is essential for energy production; oxygen consumption and carbon dioxide production also increase significantly when Centrophenoxine is taken regularly. Centrophenoxine has also been found to be very effective in the treatment of various human disorders, such as brain damage due to old age, stroke, brain injury caused by chemicals or drugs including excessive alcohol consumption. Centrophenoxine has the ability to protect against the damage caused by modern toxic environmental chemicals. Dosage: 250 1 or 2x daily

    Human Growth Hormone: (HGH)
    Human growth hormone (abbreviated to hGH) is a natural hormone, and levels have been shown to decrease as we age. hGH supplements have been described as the ultimate anti-aging therapy, with one scientific report concluding that hGH supplements were "equivalent in magnitude to (reversing) changes incurred during a 10 to 20 year period of aging." Dosage: blood monitoring required - check with your physician.

    The above list is just a general start
     
  3. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Whew, alright, the info is out.

    Between nootropic study and my scholastic studies(full time business school) I don't have that much time to post. (Statistics is a pain.:D) But I will try and check back on this thread as much as possible and answer questions and see where we go.

    Another great place for nootropic info http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?showforum=169
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2008
  4. Katzenjammer

    Katzenjammer Active Member

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    Wise Guy, I'm so glad you started this thread here. Bushy comes around here once in a while so I'm sure he'll put in his highly informed opinion. Just wondering what your "friend" is taking - dep, I'm thinking? :)
     
  5. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Hi Katz

    Yea Im busy prying and picking Bushy's head.

    This thread should be a sticky IMO

    Whats crazy is I never even really thought much about nootropics before.

    Its amazing how life drops gems from out of thin air.

    Im working on a political campaign right now. My friend is working on it with me. I have never seen a person change so radically - Not even with TRT(and that definitely can have a change)

    She takes a adrafinil and Ginko with Vitamin D3.

    The beauty of it is that one does not even need to go the script route - Many noops are OTC and all natural, and have other benefits to taking them beside noop benefits
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2008
  6. JanSz

    JanSz Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, but this thread is my baby and I will keep it COMPLETELY on topic
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 25, 2008
  7. snook

    snook New Member

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    See above

    Don't worry I still love you two ;)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 25, 2008
  8. Katzenjammer

    Katzenjammer Active Member

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    I agree that this should indeed be a sticky. I look forward to participating in this thread. Yeah, noops are pretty amazing. Like what you say about serendipity. You know how the saying goes, "there are no accidents." :)

    Perhaps noops will help us perceive better the serendipitous events that constellate around us? :D

    Also, hopefully, *ahem* these noops can help with focus so we can all *ahem!* stay on topic, eh? ;)
     
  9. GirlyMan

    GirlyMan New Member

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    The only chance of this happening is if chillin' is interested in nootropics. If not, get used to the search function. :)
     
  10. snook

    snook New Member

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    Duly noted.:)
     
  11. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Someone once posted a question awile back, about children.

    They asked how/why children have so much energy, despite the fact that they have basically no testosterone.

    Well, first, in addition to being generally very light(anyone who has lost a significant % of BF can attest to how much more energetic and light they feel - Children generally are carrying around VERY low BF%)

    They also have super vascular systems that are virtually free of debris, allowing for unbelievable blood flow throughtout the body. This is another reason.

    In addition they have long telomeres and super-charged mitochondria.

    But I think one of the biggest reasons points back to brain drugs and chemicals - Children are a bundle of energy chiefly because they are ridiculously loaded with enzyme reaction, neurotransmitters and brain chemicals.

    This is how young adults and such pick up language so fast and learn new, complex tasks such as video games, scholarly studies and anything digitally advanced like complex computer information. We have all seen kids who are literal wizards with all the new high tech devices, yet older adults who struggle with things as simple as a cell phone.

    We have seen meat-heads in the gym with 4 digit T-levels that would have trouble figuring out simple puzzle games, yet children with no test breeze right threw them with time to spare. Fortunately, science is not letting us down, and advances are being made by the day. Enter nootropics :D
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2008
  12. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I'd love to join brains with him on this topic if he'd like.

    Jump in chilln, there's plenty of room in this hot tub, where the girls are pretty and the booze flows fee ;)
     
  13. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    There certainly are no accidents. Your right about that my friend :D

    Chance always favors the prepared mind.

    Open your minds gentleman, the boundaries are truly endless :)

    I see people constantly tinkering with T and E results, looking for the magic bullet for more energy/clarity and QOL.

    I think we have been missing a HUGE piece of the puzzle. And here it is.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2008
  14. JanSz

    JanSz Well-Known Member

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    This is exactly what bothers me.
    Too much time is spend on T&E2.

    T&E2 are very important, but no more that 1% of the whole picture.
    ====================================================================

    Some like it high, some swear about low,
    I would say just make you mind, get there, and get busy with important work.

    .
    .
    .
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2008
  15. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Exactly. This is why Im so interested in this topic. Its another piece of the puzzle.

    Health optimization occurs in all our major glands, including the testicals(hormones), thryoid(thyroid stuff), pituitary(GH).

    Yet we have completely for the most part ignored what is possibly the most important one of them all - The brain.

    Good luck and happy studying Gents :D
     
  16. Katzenjammer

    Katzenjammer Active Member

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    I've been using Oxiracetam - anyone have any comparisons to aniracetam or piracetam?

    Sometimes if I'm not careful with vinpo or Ginkgo I get a little insomnia. Dialing in on the right dose is key for me.
     
  17. foobar16

    foobar16 New Member

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    Nootropics are something I dabbled with a bit before investigating hypogonadism. I discontinued them long before ever starting TRT, as I didn't want anything to stand between me and getting tuned up properly. If I can get going on TRT and move to infrequent tests, maybe I'll start them again(the last thing I want to do is mess up my lab work right now).

    First off, I'd like to mention that the 'racetams are now legal as supplements inside the United states, so one can obtain them domestically and without dealing with the legal gray area of importing non-FDA approved drugs(not that anyone every got in trouble for it, but by the letter of the law I don't believe it was legal).

    My first experience with nootropics was with something called "Sentra AM", which was given to me by my doctor. The first two days I was on it I was a royal asshole, but I quickly went back to feeling more like myself than I had in years. I can say the 3rd and 4h day were hands down the best days I've had in two years. I felt like a new person...or rather, a brilliant, driven, energetic version of myself in previous years. Everyone around me did nothing but complement me for hours. And hey, uh, the ladies loved me too :D. Sadly, the effect wore off after a couple weeks for me, as my doctor later told me was common. Read about it here and here(actually mentions it as a treatment for exposure to various chemical weapons...imagine my friends' surprise when I told them I was doing so much better after treating myself for VX exposure:p).

    Frustrated, I tried a stack of 9600mg/day of piracetam, 600mg/day of sulbutiamine, and 2400mg/day of alpha-GPC. It didn't make a huge difference, but it kept me from crashing. There were times when I was 100% sure I was going to end up in bed for the rest of the day, but low an behold I could keep on dragging along. Not great, but a definite improvement.

    I went back to my doctor(not Dr. Crisler, but another doctor I respect very much...which means a lot coming from me) and told him about my nootropic use. I was somewhat afraid to mention a non-FDA approved drug, but not only did he know more than I did about them, he admitted to trying them himself. He said he expected me to have a stronger reaction to the "Sentra AM", but that it was normal for it to stop working in that timeframe(even though the monograph claims it doesn't happen), and prescribed a micro dose of theophylline to prevent me from building a tolerance to it(I can find companies online that sell theophylline and Sentra AM together in one package). I tried it for a week without major effect, but by that time it became clear to me that I had a serious endocrine issue, and I put it on hold until I could get it sorted out.

    During my conversation about nootropics, my doctor mentioned that in military studies healthy individuals would "burn out" after about 3 months on modafinil and it would loose effectiveness. Everything I've read said that no one knows what happens when you take modafinil long term...so it was interesting that he had data on it. He claimed that they combined it with another substance(not sure how much info I should be giving out...not sure if the studies were public) and were able to prevent the tolerance from forming.

    So uh, I guess that's my anecdotal nootropic experience. Maybe I'll experiment more once this TRT thing calms down.
     
  18. GirlyMan

    GirlyMan New Member

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    I would've gone with the atropine myself ... but hey, if it works for you. ;)

    Perhaps. Or perhaps there is nothing but accidents. In any case, metaphysics is clearly off-topic so back to the topic at hand.

    I've been taking gingko and vinpocetine for a couple of years now. Never noticed anything from them but they are cheap and relatively safe so I continue to take them. Took PS for a while. Didn't notice anything from it either and it's not so cheap and I'm not sure I need to blunt my cortisol anyway so I stopped taking it.

    Biggest cognitive effect from a supplement I've noticed is from pregnenolone (but I haven't tried any of the 'racetams). I started with 60 mg orally. I felt a lot more clear-headed and "with it" and noticed that my vision seemed more "intense" (like colors seemed more saturated, can't really explain it much better). But I also felt edgy and anxious. Dropped back to 30 mg and the edginess went away. Switched to TD preg after reading here that the liver does funny things to oral preg. Started at 30 mg. Edginess came back. Dropped back to 15 mg and edginess went away. Trying 15 mg TD BID now. Seems about right for me.

    I read that the late, great Albert Hoffmann regularly took one of his inventions (discoveries?), Hydergine, up until his death earlier this year at the ripe old age of 102. (He also ingested his more infamous ergoline, but likely not as regularly.) Wonder if anyone here has any personal experience with Hydergine?
     
  19. JanSz

    JanSz Well-Known Member

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    Dr Hertoghe book, page 63, 64,
    pregnenolone
    memory hormone
    reduce fatugue, depression, protect joints, relives arthritis, speeds healing

    unusual effect, intensify the way you see colors.
    He did not mention this as any harming situation or a cause to lower the dose.



    page 271,
    signs of getting too much
    actually they are effects of too much of other hormones produced from pregnenolone.
    overexited
    swolen face (too much cortisol)
    swollen hands & feet (too much aldosterone)
    greasy hair (too much DHEA)
    most often seen in people under 35yo
    .
    .
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2008
  20. Wise Guy

    Wise Guy Talking Monkey Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Oh man I could go on for hours talking about stuff like that :D

    Right now Im taking Vinpo 10mg twice a day, along with DMAE 150mg once a day. A nice, natural, safe and effective jump into noops.


    Pregnenolone is a must, and yes, finding the right dose is critical. Especially if one is over 40, pregnenolone is probably one of those "everyday" drugs that everyone should take, DHEA and fish oil included


    And he was sharp as a tack and smart as they get. He spoke fluently and clearly like a man in his 40's, completely unlike someone his age. It is weird to watch him talk. Even more strange if you close your eyes, then open them and look at how old the person is that is speaking

    And you know what? I know noops are working already. I actually took the 5 minutes it takes to effectively learn, master and utilize the quote html functions ;)
     

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